#1 02-23-2016 12:05 pm

Yllogique
Registered: 06-27-2014
Posts: 4

Sound files - where are women's voices ?

Hi everyone !
I don't know who chooses the sound files, I guess I primarily want to talk to them, whoever they are, but it's also something I'd like everyone in animation to contemplate, because it's important smile
So, it's been a few years I've contemplated takng part in the competition, but never did, for different reasons. But one of them isn't of my doing, and I think it should be addressed.

What I like is animating female characters.
But there are definitely too few women talking in the 11seconds club. Let me make my case by simple observation of the last year and a half of competition (speaking characters only) :
Jan 16 2 male voices
Dec 15 1 female (singing)
Nov 15 2 male
Oct 15 sound FX
Sep 15 2 male
Aug 15 1 male 1 female (getting interrupted)
Jul 15 2 male
Jun 15 1 male 1 female
May 15 1 male 1 female
Apr 15 2 male
Mar 15 1 male 1 female (getting interrupted)
Feb 15 1 male
Jan 15 1 female
Dec 14 1 male 1 female
Nov 14 1 male
Oct 14 1 male
Sept 14 1 male
Aug 14 1 male
Jul 14 1 male 1 - not really defined will count it as female for the sake of boosting the numbers.

So, over 19 months of competition, if you wanted to animate a female character talking, you had 8 occasions (for 16 to animate a male character). Fair enough.
Out of these 8, 2 of them had the woman speaking getting interrupted and not talking that much, so that comes down to actually 6.
If you didn't want to animate any male character, you only got 2 occasions (for 5 male only sound files).
And 2 women interacting ? Not one. (while having 5 male/male dialogue).

So, I know these kind of lines are not easy to come upon because I've looked for them for personnal exercises - having the same problem at school. (you wouldn't believe how little pieces of media pass the Bechdel test...)

But it definitely IS a big problem for me and I'd really appreciate a little more diversity in audio files ! If you do look for them, you can find two women talking in movies & tv shows, I assure you (and I have some files I'd happily share !)

Thanks for reading me, I hope you'll consider that (if you are one of the people who select sound files) and just generally think about it (if you're anyone else).

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#2 02-24-2016 12:26 am

dannykneip
Upstanding Citizen
From: California
Registered: 08-14-2011
Posts: 223
Karmojo: 31

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

I hope your prayers are answered next month, and on a more consistent basis thereafter!  I agree it's important.


"Yeeees.  Always!"  - Orson Welles

http://www.instagram.com/dwkneip/

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#3 02-24-2016 12:24 pm

Yllogique
Registered: 06-27-2014
Posts: 4

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

(edit : original post I'm answering to has been deleted, I will still leave my response though !)

What if I want to practice animating female characters ? wink (rhethorical question, I do it on my freetime anyway, but I'd like to enter the club to get comments from the community)

If you couldn't be bothered one way or the other, then it should just be equally male and female voices ! Then everyone gets to practice what they want.

Last edited by Yllogique (02-29-2016 9:41 am)

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#4 02-24-2016 12:51 pm

thelittlepenguin84
Upright Citizen
From: Bristol
Registered: 03-30-2010
Posts: 2028
Karmojo: 47
Moderator

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

I have a speech impediment and am pretty frustrated that there are not many clips with a stutter or some other obvious disability. Kidding about the offence, but there are also less African American pieces. Or those with a French accent. Or those spoken by the elderly. Or children.

Yes, every now and again, I admittedly wonder about the range as I search for inspiration. But then each month, there are wonderful entries with ideas that I never thought of. Textures in the audio, I never quite tuned into, that the artist has captured so well.

I am sure its not a conscious decision, choosing mostly male audio. I'm sure if the person choosing audio reads this thread, it may influence what is to come. Fingers crossed you get your wish.

I hope whatever audio is chosen, it'd be nice to see you enter as your reel is beautiful.

Last edited by thelittlepenguin84 (02-24-2016 12:55 pm)

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#5 02-24-2016 2:04 pm

RyanHagen
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Registered: 06-16-2007
Posts: 1110
Karmojo: 48
Moderator

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

If you're unhappy with the sound file from 11 second club, feel free to download your own from a site and do your own.  That would be my suggestion.  You can post the "personal animation and demo reels" section and get feedback there. You aren't required to enter the competition, and you aren't required to use the sound file from here.  Instead, thank the people that make this community available and don't think too much into it.

GET MOVIE BITES HERE!


Ryan
Animator
"Frustration is the handmaiden of creativity" ~ Chuck Jones

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#6 02-24-2016 4:56 pm

tartarstudio
From: Ireland/Sudan
Registered: 09-06-2011
Posts: 34

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

I agree. And I see no harm in suggesting more diverse voice clips to the administrators of this website. I assume it is not intentional from their part and hope upon seeing your post, they would consider it in the future.

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#7 02-24-2016 5:47 pm

thelittlepenguin84
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From: Bristol
Registered: 03-30-2010
Posts: 2028
Karmojo: 47
Moderator

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

I think she has a point. there could be more female clips. also its nice to have it pointed out. it could prompt more female clips.

I notice its only your second post. It could be nice to try a few of the male audios. id also suggest using the forums for feedback. its sometimes more indepth than the voting comments. sometimes its also not. can depend on luck of your post, sometimes smile

Last edited by thelittlepenguin84 (02-24-2016 5:53 pm)

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#8 02-24-2016 11:30 pm

thelittlepenguin84
Upright Citizen
From: Bristol
Registered: 03-30-2010
Posts: 2028
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Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

I do not hear complaining. Eric I think you are wrong! As said in my previous comment, the original post has a point. It would be nice to have more female clips.

Last edited by thelittlepenguin84 (02-24-2016 11:32 pm)

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#9 02-25-2016 1:58 pm

thelittlepenguin84
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From: Bristol
Registered: 03-30-2010
Posts: 2028
Karmojo: 47
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Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

Maybe I am reading far too much into it, but I felt your comment was a touch aggressive and unnecessary.

Ryan's comment said as much as you did. I also tried to soften it. Yllogique has had no opportunity to respond.

There could be more female clips offered by the club. Her evidence points to the need for it. Though her suggestion could be stronger, had she entered a previous competition. But I fear she maybe scared away from the club, rather than encouraged to enter in future.

Last edited by thelittlepenguin84 (02-25-2016 2:00 pm)

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#10 02-25-2016 3:35 pm

snuffymcsnuff
Registered: 02-04-2013
Posts: 93

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

Eric, I agree that you're taking a seemingly pretty defensive stance on this and I can't really figure out why.

Having entered a competition before shouldn't be a prerequisite for bringing up suggestions for changes to the site. And I'm pretty sure the point of this forum is to discuss the site and the competitions. That is all Yllogique is doing, bringing up a suggestion and backing it with evidence. Telling her to "go make your own site if you're dissatisfied" seems a little immature. She's not enforcing anything here, just asking a question.

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#11 02-25-2016 7:44 pm

ericraffle
From: South Africa
Registered: 02-03-2012
Posts: 1782

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

If I come off being too defensive then maybe its just me and I apologize there as sometimes I get too involved


Good Luck !! And happy animating to all

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#12 02-29-2016 10:00 am

Yllogique
Registered: 06-27-2014
Posts: 4

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

@tartarstudio, @thelittlepenguin84 >Yes, I also don't think it is unintentionnal ! As most lack of diversity, it usually just is a continuation of what is already here - which is a lack of diversity, snake biting its tail wink

That's why I think it IS necessary to 'think too much into it' (@Ryan), because if you don't think about it you end up repeating the patterns you see everywhere smile I'm merely encouraging people to think about it.
And, @Ryan, if you take a closer look at the end of my original post, you'll see I do download my own sound files and animate my own stuff on these ! I just don't get a sense of community like I can see on here, or the motivation to work on the same thing as everyone else. You also seem to imply I am not grateful for this community, which isn't true. I do care for it and think it's great, and if I didn't I wouldn't make suggestions to try and improve it ! As I said, I have had my reasons not to enter yet, but I have engaged in the voting process quite a few times.

I just feel like it doesnt hurt anyone to think about it instead of brushing it off (and, as I see it, kinda hiding a fundamental problem under the rug, but I understand why it wouldn't be a problem to some). It IS still animation, just a more diverse animation, and animation - as well as any field, really-, could use diversity !

I don't feel like I am pushing an agenda, or being picky or imagining things : as you can see from the numbers it is just that the selection is currently extremely unbalanced.

( @snuffymcsnuff, @dannykneip : thank you smile )

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#13 02-29-2016 2:48 pm

RyanHagen
Upright Citizen
Registered: 06-16-2007
Posts: 1110
Karmojo: 48
Moderator

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

I hope my comment didn't sound snarky or put any one off.  Not my intention at all, unfortunately you can't see "emotion" in text on a forum.  I was simply making the suggestion that you have options.  And I most definitely wasn't saying you can't make suggestions, or anything like that.  I don't know how the admins go about selecting the sound files nor do I have a say in it.

I can say, I come from a period of 10secondclub and cg-char, and they both went the way of the dodo, so I definitely don't want this community to do that.

Hope that explains my comment a bit and it comes off as less "shut up and take your medicine" and more "hey, here's another option you might explore".


Ryan
Animator
"Frustration is the handmaiden of creativity" ~ Chuck Jones

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#14 02-29-2016 8:25 pm

Stina
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From: Stockholm, Sweden
Registered: 06-11-2010
Posts: 554
Karmojo: 63
Moderator

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

This kind of discussion is always a bit sensitive - especially when one of the more common troubles women face is being overly criticised. As you say Ryan, it's so easy to read too much into a few typed words. I'm thankful you came back to expand on your first post, and the discussion has stayed somewhat level headed.

Back on topic, I'd love to see more female audio files. I think it'd be more likely to happen if users found files they liked and sent to admins, as they themselves don't have a lot of time to spend on this community.


Stuff I made: www.stinaboberg.com
Days gone without mentioning knees: Not many.

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#15 03-01-2016 6:52 am

ericraffle
From: South Africa
Registered: 02-03-2012
Posts: 1782

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

Nothing holding you back this month, we all want to see a stirling animation from you as there are two female voices and neither of them are interupting one another, your wish came true. smile


Good Luck !! And happy animating to all

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#16 03-01-2016 3:01 pm

gabriel_areia
From: Brasil
Registered: 05-04-2015
Posts: 24

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

I guess they heard you.

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#17 03-01-2016 4:15 pm

thelittlepenguin84
Upright Citizen
From: Bristol
Registered: 03-30-2010
Posts: 2028
Karmojo: 47
Moderator

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

Eywa heard you!!!

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#18 03-01-2016 4:18 pm

wellings
Model Citizen
Registered: 03-17-2009
Posts: 836
Karmojo: 51
Productive!

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

Audio file issues at the moment though...

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#19 03-01-2016 4:19 pm

RyanHagen
Upright Citizen
Registered: 06-16-2007
Posts: 1110
Karmojo: 48
Moderator

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

This place needs a like button....I just spit out coffee penguin....you suck:D


Ryan
Animator
"Frustration is the handmaiden of creativity" ~ Chuck Jones

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#20 03-01-2016 8:25 pm

dannykneip
Upstanding Citizen
From: California
Registered: 08-14-2011
Posts: 223
Karmojo: 31

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

Simple suggestions are wonderful things.  Thank you, Yllogique, for making a strong case for a tad more diversity (because it challenges all of us to think outside the box each month) and thank you to the Admins for supplying so many amazing audio clips, including the lyrical one, and all the sound effects!


"Yeeees.  Always!"  - Orson Welles

http://www.instagram.com/dwkneip/

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#21 03-04-2016 9:13 am

Yllogique
Registered: 06-27-2014
Posts: 4

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

Yay ! Like you guys, I'm really happy about this month's audio file ! I might finally enter smile if it had anything to do with my suggestion I'm really glad smile

Thank you Ryan for coming back and expanding on your thoughts.

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#22 03-04-2016 6:52 pm

Winterstride
Registered: 12-05-2013
Posts: 102

Re: Sound files - where are women's voices ?

This month's audio is a great start for diversifying the audio around here.

The 11 Second Club is, in many ways, the go-to place for animators on the internet. It's quite ubiquitous, so whatever audio it chooses for its official competition has a lot of reach to a lot of people all over the world. And because most of the clips come from American film, and most American film tends to write certain stories and cast certain actors, the 11 Second Club can sound like the White Guy Talking Club most of the year.

It extends beyond this, too. Most good free rigs are dudes, with their female counterparts usually cost money, and they're usually caucasian by default - if they even have any built-in controls to change stuff like that.

There's no hard and fast thing to do to diversify the competition, just a lot of little steps that'll make it better for everyone.

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